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MySF Administrator
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We are currently checking how we could add in functionality similar to what is outlined in bryanlovquist's post above (third from the top).
The main problem with such approaches is that you would still need to wait around to receive the final statement with all of the detailed information, by which time you may have also started to receive distributions for the following year. This means that you cannot tag it against an asset, which is what would be the logical solution otherwise.
It also adds an extra step to year end processing where distribution accumulation records would need to be split.
This and other difficulties are probably a big part of the reason why there is no investment and asset management software package that has such functionality at the moment.
Regards,
MySF
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Maybe I am expecting too much, but unless this can be sorted out, my accountant will be repeating his recent advice to me, namely that using MySF is of questionable value when he has to spend so much time at the end of the year sorting out the figures to prepare an accurate tax return.[/quote]
To be fair to the MySF guys, if the entity can't tell you definitively during the year what the tax position of their distributions is, you can't really expect MySF to accurately post the entries until year end.
As for your suggestion Wanzhu, it means you won't have an accurate picture during the year of the fund's tax position. I would like to know within a reasonable margin what the fund tax position is during the year. Thus I would prefer to enter the 'pro forma' information that accompanies each distribution - which is typically 90%+ correct - and then make a relatively minor adjustment at year end.
(As an aside Wanzhu, I would have thought the fund accounts should be already correct and signed off by the auditor before the accountant prepares the tax return. Do you sequence it some other way?)
As per my previous post (08 Sep), what is needed is a simpler way of presenting the screens to amend the information at year end - whichever way the system operates. The MySF guys say that this needs some major rework on the system so let's see what emerges. Hopefully it won't be TOO long coming!
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Regular Member
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If the approach that MySF is taking is generally as described in the third post, ie. usage of a suspense account(s). It may not be necessary to wait until MySF has completed all of the work associated with this enhancement.
If MySF was to inform us of the specification of the suspense account(s). We would be able to manually create the account(s) and continue with the posting of the distribution transactions. When the enhancement was complete, the upgrade procedure could ask the user for the deatails re. the suspense account or notice that it already exists and not attempt to create it.
The update could then conceivably be delayed until this EOY.
It is the generation of the EOY journal which is complex and we don't need that immediately.
Regards
Bryan Lovquist
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[Quote]To be fair to the MySF guys, if the entity can't tell you definitively during the year what the tax position of their distributions is, you can't really expect MySF to accurately post the entries until year end.
As for your suggestion Wanzhu, it means you won't have an accurate picture during the year of the fund's tax position. I would like to know within a reasonable margin what the fund tax position is during the year. Thus I would prefer to enter the 'pro forma' information that accompanies each distribution - which is typically 90%+ correct - and then make a relatively minor adjustment at year end. [End quote]
I don't want MySF to do the impossible. If there is no data available from the paying institution, then obviously nothing can be entered until it is available. What I am saying is that the software should be designed (says I, who has no clue about software design!) to reflect what actually happens and, when that data does become available, at year end, there is a simple means to enter it up to produce the required journal entries and an accurate tax position.
I don't need to keep track of my fund's tax position during the year, although I understand that others may. In any event, the distributions that I receive during the year give no information at all, apart from the sum being paid, so I have no hope of working out the tax position.
Finally, in case you are wondering, I really like using MySF, and I am hoping, hoping, hoping, that this deficiency can be remedied.
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Regular Member
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Hello
I was wondering if you have had an oportunity to consider my suggestion (two above) where I put forth the proposal that MySF make public the specs to the suspense account. We could then create it manually and continue with the entry of distribution transactions.
Given that the first quarter is now over, I have distributions that have to be entered. I am currently resorting to a spreadsheet to maintain an accurate picture of the asset situation.
Regards
Bryan Lovquist
PS - If not, do you have any idea how long it will be before you release the upgrade?
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MySF Administrator
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Modification to distribution processing.
This posting describes proposed changes to distribution processing in MySF Manager.
Current difficulties stem from the fact that there are cases when companies issue several distributions during a given tax year without providing specific breakdowns.
To address this problem, distributions handling will be amended to allow distribution records to be tagged for completion at a later date. The completion process must then be run before year end to ensure that all details relevant to income and taxation are provided.
Step 1) Recording a distribution with only the full amount provided.
There will be a modification to the distributions screen, which will be to add a checkbox allowing the distribution to be tagged as “details pending”. To retain accuracy in bank reconciliations, the distribution will still require that an amount be specified as received. The distribution will then be processed as normal, typically with the full amount recorded to 4110 – Distributions Received.
For example a distributions of $150 on 1 May, without exact details of breakdown, would be recorded as Franked Amount $150, Income Account: 4110 – Distributions Received, Details Pending.
http://www.mysf.com.au/images/uploads/1334886285_d1.JPG
Step 2) Allocating amounts when details are received.
An additional menu item will be added, called “Complete Distribution Details”. This function should be invoked when full details of the distributions received from a particular company are received.
Completing distribution details takes three steps:
i) Select which asset’s distribution details have been received.
ii) Allocate the full amount.
At this point the full dollar amount of “details pending” tagged distributions from this asset will be shown, and asked to be allocated across a screen that closely resembles the current distribution screen.
iii) Automated amendment.
After validation and confirmation the system will proceed to amend the distributions previously entered, based on the amount received as a percentage of the total distribution in each instance.
Continuing from Step 1, if another distribution was received for $30 and recorded as details pending; users would need to allocate a total of $180 of income across the various fields, which would then be automatically allocated proportionately across the same fields for the two distributions. This would actually mean that the distributions processed would be reversed and new distributions processed, this time with full details.
The screenshot below shows an example where there were no distributions other than the $150 was received, but the administrator has received the details of the distribution of the $150 and can now split is accurately. In such a situation, the process would also adjust the entry made.
The year end process would not be allowed to run until there are no more distributions tagged as “details pending”.
http://www.mysf.com.au/images/uploads/791569200_d2.JPG
We would like to invite MySF users to comment on this proposal, either by posting a reply in this thread, or by emailing us at info@mysf.com.au
Regards,
MySF
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Regular Member
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Hello
In general, this looks similiar to what I was expecting.
Were the amounts shown on the screen images intended to reflect the documentation? If they were, then I don't understand.
It was also not clear to me the process which would be followed
in the case where more than one distribution is received and entered via the "Distributions" screen.
Perhaps the documentation "Continuing from Step 1, ... " could be enhanced.
Is there any way that the process could be made VERY robust re. potential errors? The application does have all of the "amount" data for each distribution. Is it necessary that the user re-enter this when performing "Complete Distribution Details".
Could you post the set of transactions that you would expect to generate from the "Distributions" screen entries and the subsequent transactions that you would expect to generate as a result of the "Complete Distribution Details" screen. Please us an example incorporating more than one distribution being entered on the "Distributions" screen for a singe asset.
Regards
Bryan Lovquist
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MySF Administrator
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Were the amounts shown on the screen images intended to reflect the documentation? If they were, then I don't understand.
The text of the message above has now been updated to be more in line with the data on the screenshots.
We will post a longer and more details description of the process that would be undertaken, but to answer some of the specific questions:
Yes, it would be necessary to enter the amount again, as this would serve as another checkpoint to make sure that there have been no entries missed or duplicated through the year.
The specific transactions generated would depend entirely on the actual details of the distribution, so it is a little difficult to be precise with account numbers etc. What is likely is that there would be no use of suspense accounts, as the received amount can be placed straight into 4110 - Distributions Received, and reversed out if needed at the time that details are provided.
Regards,
MySF
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Regular Member
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Re your reply above concerning the entry of the total distribution amount.
Is it your intention then that the "Complete Distribution Details" functionality would check the amount entered against the total of the distributions entered via the "Distributions" functionality and would not allow the process to continue if there was a mismatch?
Will the transaction created as a result of "Complete Distribution Details" possibly include both a logical credit and debit to 4110 - Distributions Received? I am sorry, I cannot remember the form of the transaction generated in the current version of the software. If so, would usage of a suspense account not be more robust? After EOY processing, one simple check would be to ensure that the amount in the suspense account has been reduced to zero.
Regards
Bryan Lovquist
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Regular Member
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Sorry, I realised that the point that I was trying to make in my last post was not clear.
The comment re. "logical credit and debit ..." was not well formed.
The question that I should have asked is:
Do you expect the transaction generated as a result of the "Complete Distribution Details" functionality to leave funds (re. that set of distributions) in the 4110 account. If so, it would seem that the meaning or interpretation of the account changes as transactions are processed against it. It is not an income account until after the last "Complete Distributiuon Details" functionality is complete. Before that it is a combination suspense/income account.
I think a designated suspense account approach is cleaner, if for no other reason that errors in data entry are a lot easier to detect and 4110 remains an income account whose interpretation has/does not change.
Regards
Bryan Lovquist
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